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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 2, 2021 14:05:57 GMT -8
Anyway, the Urn of Sacred Ashes was acquired without too much difficulty. The silly riddles were solved, the silly duplicate battle was won, the silly puzzle had its solution looked up, and the Ashes were acquired. Eamon was healed, and the plans for the Landsmeet were made. Now, only one question remains...
...where the heck is Orzamar? If it's on the map, it's certainly not identified as such. My best guess would be the mountains to the West, but I'm not sure.
By the way, through the power of cheating, Alistair is now decked out in a set of Blood Dragon Plate Armor. Which rocks.
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Post by Daos on Jan 2, 2021 14:34:36 GMT -8
If Eamon is healed, that means you unlocked Champion, too.
So, the Sacred Urn of Ashes, the remains of the Maker's bride, Andraste, turned out to be real and have magical properties. Surely then, that must be proof that she was special in some way, right? On the other hand, the cavern where you found her ashes was loaded with lyrium. Maybe it was just centuries of being exposed to magical radiation that made the ashes special. That's part of what I love about this game; it could be either way.
Anyway, you want the Frostback Mountain Pass; it's the entrance to the dwarven kingdom of Orzammar.
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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 4, 2021 6:49:39 GMT -8
Ah...not a big fan of ambiguity. I'm fonder of "facts" that are presented as true, and later conclusively proven to be false. I'd give you some examples from Ozymandias, but...you know. Spoilers. A brief save loading dance around was found to be necessary, because I apparently started a romance with Alistair? Without even noticing? All I did was give him his mom's amulet and say "yes, I remembered the story about your mom's amulet." Can Female PCs get high approval with Alistair without romancing him? If not, that...sucks. Friends are a thing that exist, Bioware! Or perhaps I just said the wrong/right thing. But anyway, we did everything over again, and headed off to Orzamarr. There, I discovered that I had been on easy for...probably the entirety of the Brecilian Forest and Urn of Sacred Ashes quests. Which is dreadfully embarrassing, because I was thinking "I've gotten pretty good at Normal difficulty! This is barely a challenge at all! I should up the difficulty a bit!" Anyway, it's interesting that Dwarf Society is terrible. The caste system would have actually been ok, if not for the existing of the casteless, due to acceptable intermarriage and social mobility. But those who go to the surface are forever barred from true Dwarf society again. Poor Bodhain and Sandal... It's also interesting that they all have American accents. I found that amusing. In fact, I do like how the accents in this game are actually consistent (British for Fereldan, American for Orzzamar, French for Orley...vaguely Middle Eastern for Antiva), unlike most fantasy settings, where they just stick accents to people based on personality. Oh, and I have it on good authority that you can acquire a pet Nug for Leiliana. PLEASE SHARE THIS WISDOM
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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 4, 2021 8:46:41 GMT -8
Well, through the power of looking stuff up, I acquired a Nug for Leiliana. That's about the only positive thing that happened today.
I am SICK of Dwarves. I am SICK of Dwarves and Dwarf politics. The two annoying lads basically forced me into a decision, and I barely know either of them. I have no idea what their views are, which one is better for Orzamar, and I just had to pick one. Then, it turns out I could have went into the Deep Roads to search for Branka, the Paragon! I learned this from Ohgren, the amazing Steve Blum Dwarf Berserker. The only problem? HE WON'T GO WITH ME BECAUSE I'VE BEEN DOING WORK FOR BHELDEN! (i.e. about half a quest) With my luck, I've just permanently lost my opportunity to recruit him. Of course, not all is lost. I just got permission to go into the Deep Roads to "help Bhelden" (haha, right). Branka shall be found, retrieved, we can tell Bhelden and Harrowmont to piss off, and Ohgren will like me and join the party just in time to die in a Blight. Yay!
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Post by HorizonsDream on Jan 4, 2021 11:33:02 GMT -8
I think I consistently picked Harrowmont during the dwarven quests because he seemed like less than an asshole.
I do find it amusing how you seemed to kind of breeze through the Scared Ashes quest because I had a hell of a time going through that quest through each play through only to learn that you were on easy. The duplicate fight was probably the hardest I had to deal with. I hated it with a passion.
This is a warning. The deep roads are horrible. It was the most miserable part of the game for me. It was never ending! I don't want to spoil anything though, so I will just leave it there with that warning.
As for romance, Alistiar is actually fairly easy to romance. I found that Zev was a little harder to romance despite the fact that he is constantly flirting.
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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 4, 2021 11:42:53 GMT -8
Really, that's why I hate the quest. You have to make a decision before you know anything substantial about either of them. I just picked Behlden because people were complaining about him leaving the old ways behind, and I've made my dislike of the old ways pretty clear.
Also, yeah. The Deep Roads are kind of annoying. When I was going through the very first section, my thoughts were "Is this the most hated part of the game? Because the Fade was the second most."
Anyway, we went off and killed the mobster lady for Bhelden, thus getting us one step closer to Branka, ie. one step closer to Ohgren, ie. one step closer to "piss off, both of you stupid Dwarf kings"
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Post by Daos on Jan 4, 2021 15:31:49 GMT -8
Sorry, long shift at work today, so I am just now able to reply. Re: Alistair's Romance It is super easy to romance Alistair by accident. Basically, just be nice to him, don't make fun of him or badmouth Duncan or the Wardens, and act a little bossy and he falls for you. If you reject him once he tries to give you a rose, though, that'll be the end of it. You'll basically friendzone him, for lack of a better term. Re: Bodhain and Sandal Don't feel too bad for them. Bodhain seems pretty happy on the surface. Even has a wife in Denerim. And I'm not sure if Sandal even considers Orzammar his home. Re: Accents Antiva is actually supposed to be Italy, so Zevran is meant to sound Italian. Re: Nug Well, you already figured this one out on your own, so I have nothing else to add. Re: Bhelen vs Harrowmont This is again one of those situations where a different origin would have offered different insights. If you play as a dwarf commoner, then you wind up working for Bhelen, who does a lot to help you out. Your sister winds up pregnant by him, meaning that her child will likely be a noble, too. And for what it's worth, Bhelen seems to treat her pretty well. On the other hand, if you play a dwarf noble, then Bhelen is your baby brother. He kills your other brother, then frames you for it. You are then thrown into the Deep Roads as punishment, basically death by darkspawn (for even during a Blight, there are quite a few of them still down there). Luckily, Duncan finds you and saves you by recruiting you into the Wardens. So depending on your origin, you may have a very different opinion of Bhelen; you may see him as a possible savior and progressive; or you might be honked off that he tried to kill you. But you are a City Elf, so these are all a bunch of strangers you know nothing about, but you still gotta choose somebody to be in charge, because as long as there is a succession crisis, the dwarves cannot aid you in fighting the Blight. In terms of politics, what I can tell you is that Harrowmont is a good and honorable man, and the last king's dying wish was for Harrowmont to succeed him. But he's a traditionalist. Nothing will change under his rule. Bhelen, on the other hand, is a ruthless, manipulative murderer. If he takes the throne, he'll disband the Assembly and rule with an iron fist. But he does enact some very progressive laws, like allowing Casteless more rights if they enlist in the military and reduces restrictions on trade with the surface. He basically tries to drag Orzammar, kicking and screaming, into the modern age. To be honest, this is the one moral dilemma I had the most trouble with on my first playthrough. And the only one where I wasn't entirely sure I did the right thing afterward. But I can tell you this: While you are made to commit to a decision early on, it's not final. You will have the chance to change your mind at the end of the Orzammar storyline, so don't stress too much on it. Re: Oghren I told you Irving was not the Steve Blum-ist character Steve Blum plays in this game! But don't worry about recruiting him. He tells you to sod off regardless of who you work for; if you had chosen Harrowmont, he would have done the same thing. He will automatically join you later, when you are sent into the Deep Roads. Re: Deep Roads Yes, the Deep Roads are the most hated part of the game by the fandom. They are long (something like 10 hours, I think?), all pretty samey, and mostly just combat after combat. It's not so bad on your first playthrough, but in subsequent ones, it can get pretty tiresome. FYI: Shale's personal quest can be completed in the Deep Roads. Also, have you met Dagna yet?
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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 4, 2021 15:46:00 GMT -8
Yeah, the Deep Roads are brutal. I have no shame in turning difficulty to easy as I slog through. Unfortunately, I haven't even unlocked Shale's quest yet, so that's something to backtrack on. I have met Dagna! She's quite adorable. I haven't asked the Circle about taking her in, yet.
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Post by Daos on Jan 4, 2021 20:54:41 GMT -8
No backtracking is needed yet. Shale's quest is unlocked after you find Branka. But if they are not in your party at the time, you'll have to trek back to camp, put them in the party, and head all the way back to the Deep Roads again. On the other hand, taking Shale with you the first time, means having three warriors in your party (Oghren and yourself being the others), so you can only take either a rogue or a mage, but not both. So it's up to you if you want to deal with all of the Deep Roads in one go, or if you don't mind returning there later.
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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 5, 2021 6:26:26 GMT -8
No backtracking is needed yet. Shale's quest is unlocked after you find Branka. But if they are not in your party at the time, you'll have to trek back to camp, put them in the party, and head all the way back to the Deep Roads again. On the other hand, taking Shale with you the first time, means having three warriors in your party (Oghren and yourself being the others), so you can only take either a rogue or a mage, but not both. So it's up to you if you want to deal with all of the Deep Roads in one go, or if you don't mind returning there later. At this point, I'm afraid I've already begun the trek, with a party of Leiliana, Wynne, and Ohgren. So, yeah. Backtracking will be necessary. Is it possible to "go back" once you've started the Landsmeet? i.e. Are you in the "endgame" once you've triggered it, and thus you can't do anything but complete it and fight the final boss?
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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 5, 2021 10:19:53 GMT -8
Anyway, we finally made our way through the Deep Roads, fought the Broodmother, fought the weird...tiki head thing, and met with the anvil's creator, who wished it destroyed. Because of course, creating golems is a nasty business. (Hmm, perhaps that'll be what Shale's quest is about) It was either Branka or him, and, though I did contemplate the possibility of an army of golems, I went for the right thing once more. Ohgren's (apparently) wife was killed, but he didn't seem too torn up about that. I ended up giving the crown to Harrowmont because it was funny. ("You would let this elf choose? She is Bhelden's hireling!" "Ok, here you go Mr. Mont." "uhh....thanks")
Jeez...I never wanna see another Dwarf again.
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Post by Daos on Jan 5, 2021 13:47:51 GMT -8
Is it possible to "go back" once you've started the Landsmeet? i.e. Are you in the "endgame" once you've triggered it, and thus you can't do anything but complete it and fight the final boss? Once you complete the Landsmeet, you can still go anywhere you want except for Redcliffe. If you enter Redcliffe, you trigger the endgame, and that is the point of no return. So if there's anything you must do in Redcliffe, do that before the Landsmeet. Anything else can wait until after, if you want. Anyway, we finally made our way through the Deep Roads, fought the Broodmother, fought the weird...tiki head thing, and met with the anvil's creator, who wished it destroyed. Because of course, creating golems is a nasty business. (Hmm, perhaps that'll be what Shale's quest is about) It was either Branka or him, and, though I did contemplate the possibility of an army of golems, I went for the right thing once more. Ohgren's (apparently) wife was killed, but he didn't seem too torn up about that. I ended up giving the crown to Harrowmont because it was funny. ("You would let this elf choose? She is Bhelden's hireling!" "Ok, here you go Mr. Mont." "uhh....thanks") Jeez...I never wanna see another Dwarf again. Ah, yes, the Broodmother...the horrible secret of how darkspawn are 'birthed' is revealed. Suffice to say, from this point on, when female Wardens feel their Calling beginning, they are given a second option to die peacefully in their sleep, instead of the normal routine of heading to the Deep Roads to fight until you die. Just to make sure they aren't captured and turned into more Broodmothers. I, too, destroyed the anvil. Granted, allowing its use is a means to help the dwarves reclaim some of their territory from the darkspawn. But let's be honest--the vast majority of people who will be forced into becoming golems will be casteless, and their lot is all ready pretty rough. Yeah, Oghren loves Branka, but he recognizes she's lost it. I went with Harrowmont, as well, and also chose to destroy the anvil. And never see a dwarf again? Even Oghren? And Dagra? And Sandal???
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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 5, 2021 13:55:48 GMT -8
And never see a dwarf again? Even Oghren? And Dagra? And Sandal??? Well, that is a gross exaggeration. Anyway, I've mostly been walking the world, tying up a few loose ends, like Wynne's personal quest and all of Zevran's conversations. Oh, and I got that random encounter with the Monty Python reference and the super-powerful axe. So...yay?
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Post by Daos on Jan 5, 2021 19:34:29 GMT -8
There's also an encounter that references Superman and one that does Lord of the Rings.
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Post by GravityEmblem on Jan 6, 2021 12:57:59 GMT -8
There's also an encounter that references Superman and one that does Lord of the Rings. Well, at least the last one's thematically appropriate. Anyway, I did some mopping up stuff--turning in a few quests in Orzamarr (including Dagna!), grabbing Sten's Sword, doing a few other sidequests in Denerim before I realized I needed to talk to Eamon in Redcliffe first. We headed to the castle and begun the quest. After a brief back and forth with Loghain and good 'ol Howe, who Coriander got to insult pretty good for...you know. PURGING HER HOME and all. Then, it was off to Howe's estate, to rescue Queen Anora. I realized a bit late that the game wanted me to put on the disguises, which I did not do. Thus, I got a bit of a beating from Howe's men. I did manage to make it through after a few tries (thank the Maker for Cleansing Aura. Without it, I couldn't have defeated a single grunt for injuries) Howe was killed after a very close battle, that mostly consisted of Wynne desperately keeping Alistair and herself alive while he punched Howe and an accompanying mage to death. (Freaking bees, man) Oh, and he also implied that Anora is as conniving and scheming as he is. So...that's something to think about.
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